grim23 | Community Forum

"I need to learn about how to interact with others better and deal with how people really think and feel about me. Honesty, not fawning. Community forum. No filters. ... Fire away, both barrels."

*hugs*

See, now that's character.

Unfortunately, with the needing to be to work at 6:00 AM tomorrow, my input will have to wait. Because, dude. You deserve more than something off-the-cuff when you're taking it this seriously.

I think you sometimes get lost in form and forget function.

But I say PISS OFF to who ever said that. This is YOUR journal where you get to express YOUR feelings without worrying about whatever other people think about whatever it is you have to say about what you are feeling. This should be your sancuary for your thoughts and people who read it need to be respectful of that. They need to also remember that they are reading it by choice and that if they don't enjoy it they can not look at it. Although I would call such people fair weather friends.

Grim, you take care of everyone around you in life and you are constantly trying to better yourself. I don't think it's a bad thing to have one place where you can come to and get support for yourself for a change. Some people don't like to see the Rock in thier life exhibit weakness. They want to see the Rock be rock-like at all times, because if the Rock ever crumbles, then how can they themselves ever expect to get by? But we are all human, even Rocks like you. And we all need support because we all feel fear and anger and we all question ourselves sometimes. And we all need to be able to do that. My only suggestion of aspects of your self that you might change would be to cut yourself some slack. That and get a narrower friends filter.

So there you go. There's my 2 cents of honesty. Maybe not quite the answer you were expecting, and I don't doubt it may ruffle some feathers, but I've never been a go with the flow kind of girl. So there.

Smooch!

In other words...

"Your Live journal is really too much all about you. Could you have it be more about us?"

...is not something I would tolerate hearing from people who claimed to call themselves my friends.

Nope... it's not just you... Damn Straight TOG & Pinkk
~Aurora

I was not sure how to contact you any other way, that did not take me back into the mess I made of Grim's LJ...

but I was already incredibly impressed with you from that! and from how highly Grim speaks of you... and now I come to your LJ, and the very first post I see has me stunned in awe at you, and your amazingly strong courageous self...

it would seem we are going through some similar growth processes... and I would be very honored to have the opportunity to get to know you... I was proud of everything you said, and how you defended Grim when he was well... standing alone facing the rocks... and that alone is worthy of my respect. May I "friend" you?

*bows low to one Grim says outstrips him by far with her amazing gift of Submission*...
~Aurora

Well thanks, although I didn't really do much besides lose my temper. And I don't kow about me outstriping Grim in the submission category. I've seen that man in action, so...

Anyhoo, friend away. Everyone can always use more friends.

In my oh-so-humble opinion of course.

Fawning is proper sometimes from those true to how and what that means for each of us individually ~ regarding you, if we can't tell you we tell your journal. This doesn't mean we don't also give you our own two sense, in a way not as obvious as calling you out, butt dancing as you can't teach anything you never learned, so it doesn't really do you much good if saying this lesson. We also know you may see things differently than from our colored view. It does help sometimes to really quit looking though, and allow yourself to reach out and grasp what is there for you. As eyes may not be true always, wrapping your hand around destiny brings physical the form maybe your touch will open your awareness of aroma, and the slight taste on your tongue grows stronger causing an eruption of laughter to escape you. If relying on visual sense of yourself then will really look the fool if never sensing more that we feel of you. I have written twice since viewing this and when lj dropped "my face your truths rant" the 2nd time, I was aware enough that this strategy was not pinkk helping you learn about you. Must attack from another way, then it came to pinkk madness is truth some pups fawn because it shows all *WOOF WOOF* so your eyes will see it!

templeofgod ~ Thanks it made me think about new strategy of my own life, also applies to trying to post something to Grim that wasn't letting me feel comfortable in such a slant of how I am expected to see one I choose to look admiringly on. as if shamed to finding faults in him would bring forth admiration from himself to have those faults. while not finding some faults the same for each of us, we all share as His fault ~ allowing such strong friends to give words to whatever they feel towards him ~ I didn't fear being the only to feel encouragement is valid, butt nice to know others still felt heated over this. expressing what he brings forth in us, is harder if thought of as less important based on views of others watching from views all so different too!

Admiration is not a safe place from our critical eyes peering so intently, I would assume it to be rather strange all of us watching and learning, butt not touching or speaking of course we always smell nice! So can't be thought of as really caring if we choose to *hug* and flirt with your spirit even through things we see your struggling with and each understand your words from different source of your varied parts. Running with any pack makes survival of fittest the truth, butt run with many packs your survival still finds truth must remain the fittest. *Butt* because in my view sweetest truth may be glimpsing the what that makes you *run* by letting you feel that completely! I believe as you still find where you are, it won't be much of a surprise that some of us reacted this way. We see the being you are for each of us, and with much biased as is our own right. Even in a public forum a bratt can throw a hissy fit, butt would rather throw warmth and concern to one who has always only brings forth in me, a better understanding of choices only we can make and all will teach us as well as others even if not understanding of it when given ~ Lessons remain until needed to teach self again or time comes for you to be the lesson to another when your time is theirs. Maybe thats why I feel mad that loving you is viewed as stroking you as if already dismissing the worth sent from such strokes ~ just as you have let those willing to dismiss themselves from stroking you, also know your willingness to allow such a soul ~ YOURS ~ to go without strokes is also your own dismissal of the flesh and I don't believe we will see eye 2 eye on this being allowed as skin means touch and feeling you up

~ the STROKING of you can be arranged so not confused thats absolute Pinkk Whore speaking only tongue of wench truths. Of physical *slutiskiss* flesh of Grim rippled! as seems to be a felt need yours of course ~ Not to get laid or even feel like seeing flesh or flattery from your friends. Feathers of friends should not be ruffled when we all known we share him so differently. and reminding you a pup still protective and bratt whore will not allow dismissal just because you are felt up and afraid! it might taste like it smells if you grasped it to lick, bet you would see what you needed to and enjoy with all you are Warrior Healer Slave and King *Butt more Butt* always if you allowed this to you completely some wouldnt feel need to be at the knee licking your hand, butt always still Will be pinkk beast *Woof Woofin' at you Grim* and sweet licks upon the palm all pinkk sense you feel my view enough! Well unless of course someone was using power dynamics as a tool to inspire my weaker mind to actually Woof Woof as if truth I am only a pup but fierce is heart of a dog and true you bring forth my beast! We are always aware picking at your layers will not expose deeper you, only you will allow that ~ of yourself ~ once willing to let the peeling of you bring forth the feeling all you are then we can be the proof *face your truths honestly w/o fawning* All you need, to face is heat of your firey spirit consuming someone, with whole your being! as cold your shoulder freezes souls almost mid stupidity I realize its how you choose to feel less pain, is the gift you wish to grant those who dare closer than the close you will allow. *gee masochistic me*
*hugs* can be sent, my truth to you wish only heat feeling you up always with Love pinkk bratt pup whore and still fawning as is my place ever since I looked it up, and with a patience alas I could properly be so defined. giggling even truths pinkk are still just ours to define

well said girlie Pinkk... :)

Thanks Lady with spirit of Grim in your eyes. Though do enjoy his sarcasm rather poetic to allow this thread ~ loving him also means some times we must learn to shout when we find worth, in our own growth we can help his. This forum for various reasons not 1 I would pick I'm glad he didn't filter any friends from view or expressing thoughts regarding him because some are strong enough now we can even speak back to Grim as heated for all even when hiding way south in California, the fear can't stop how we feel. Funny I've done 7 things today that he'll feel ~ hope they don't give him a paper cut! Fawning pinkk

Wow... Pinkk that compliment will be kept in my heart as one of the highest compliments I have ever received... I will always strive to be worthy of it.

*kisses Pinkk cheeks*
~Aurora

I do not pretend to know what has brought this need to the surface within yourself to find a deeper understanding and gnosis of YOU, by allowing those who see you in all your myriad forms, all the Light, and all the Dark, all your beauty and strength, and all your humanness... to hold their respective perspective mirrors up to you for view... *smiles at an image in my mind of a mirror you recently held up for me*... But I do see the amazing courage, and personal strength and willingness to allow a measure of true vulnerability into your life.

I swear now if you stop me this time I shall not speak to you for a week ;)... *laughs as if she could actually follow through on that threat*

*bows low, forehead to the floor, NOT in submission, but as one Warrior acknowledging great bravery to another... as he once offered to her*

What I would wish to share with you, in my limited knowledge of your Selves, and the truest man of Light and Balance I have ever known, I shall keep within my heart until I can share it with you personally, privately, over coffee, as it is meant to be between us... but I could not hold from telling you that I am very proud of you... and that is not stroking... just acknowledgement of the truth of You as seen through mine own eyes and heart.

Ever Yours, and acknowledging your own journey,
~Aurora

Grim –

A few observations from Outside.

You seek to become silk-wrapped iron, but this is brittle and a poor tool. Eastern Warrior philosophy warns against being the unbending oak that breaks in a strong wind; rather, it suggests bamboo, which bends to the wind and rebounds to stand another day.

Also like the Zen story of the prospective Student visiting the Master. When the Master pours tea, and the cup overflows, the Student protests. The Master states the Student’s mind is like the cup – already full and overflowing. You must empty your cup and start anew.

You use Chaos as a shield. You wrap it around yourself when convenient; e.g., when a relationship or an obligation is becoming burdensome to you. It becomes a convenient excuse to run people off. But you rarely directly run them off. Instead, you neglect the relationship until they leave, and then comfort yourself that they left you. You are intelligent and strong-willed enough that you could take control of your life anytime you wanted to and eliminate chaos from you life; instead, you choose to wield Chaos as a weapon.

You do use power dynamics to intimidate, but you do so in a stealthy manner. You use both magical energy and martial arts energy (e.g., Chi or Ki) to project and push at people to make them uncomfortable and back off; this is why people for your performance review stated they were uncomfortable but were unable to give exact instances. This shows you can use and project energy well; think what other, more productive, opportunities you could use it for.

Best wishes

templeofgod is quite right that your LJ should be and is rightfully about you. However, you (and

nericksx) are also correct that it is a public forum. It is only private if you make it so. It is very, very easy to make an entry only you can see – it is a matter of selecting one item from a listbox before you post – or even after, by editing the post. It is just as easy to make an entry “friends only” and simply defriend the persons whom you don’t wish to have access to those posts. You can also filter, but that's a little more complicated.

On a personal note, my initial concern grew out of a sense of "Why does this journal always feel like somebody's throwing a pity-party? I know he's stronger than that!" followed by "whoa. It's looking like he's going to disregard an important lesson because he doesn't consider the teacher worthy. I thought he was smarter than that."

While I'm not familiar with [his] metaphors and parables, your anonymous Outside observer said several things that rang true with me. And more succinctly than I had hoped to voice the same thing. Recollect, if you will, what you told me at the buffet about your manner of severing relationships. I also recall you telling me you had pushed chi at me to awaken me from outside my room. That event was not offensive, by the way, but demonstrates that you are quite aware of how to wield a weapon that leaves no evidence.

I have already mentioned instances (in comments to the post that started this discussion) that leave a bad taste of condescension - I'll not reiterate those. However, I'll add that I have vivid recollection of approximately seven distinct live interactions with you. Of those, the only ones that did not contain some element of condescension or competition are those in which you were teacher and I student, and the ones that took place when you were a guest in my home. Civil, we can do (well, I hope you read this in the tone of civility in which I write, at any rate). Friendly, we're not so good at. I wish we were.

When I first read your horoscope and personality test, I was astonished at how much of them rang true. As time goes on, though, I must admit that my personal experience has not been broad enough to lend evidence to those feelings. However, what I have seen and felt (in addition to what is above) is that you tend to tell people you hold them in higher regard than you by your actions demonstrate. I can't count the times I've missed hanging out with you because I wasn't on your direct route or I was otherwise inconvenient - and this in spite of your initial assertion that I ranked "a 9.2" and a later declaration that this had not changed. It's not my place to speak for

nericksx and the RWB, so I won't - but perhaps you can extrapolate.

About "how to interact with others better," my suggestion is to set aside your power-dynamic approach. Excessive use of power dynamics tends to get a person labeled a condescending asshole, even, perhaps especially, when it's about use of chi rather than any statement or activity that can be successfully documented. Yes, dynamics exist, but they are thickly veiled by the conventions of polite interaction. I suspect the veil may have grown too thin in your case. Maybe, instead of silk over steel, you need a few inches of foam rubber and crushed velvet.

My hope is, as ever, that this helps more than it hurts. Feel free to respond to my email if you'd like to discuss our personal relationship further.

And just in case I am not being clear enough above… as myGirl would say… now I begin my rant! ~

It has been my earnest belief that because of my great love for him, all of Grim’s friends are deserving of my utmost respect and admiration simply by having earned his friendship. But current behavior is causing me to question the level of respect truly deserved and the level of friendship certain of his friends are exhibiting. It is quite true that a friend will tell you when you have broccoli in your teeth… HOWEVER… a TRUE friend will do so by gently leaning over, whispering in your ear in a very discreet manner, shielding you physically from the sight of others, giving you an opportunity to remove the offending green vegetable in privacy, with discretion, compassion and consideration for your feelings, your vulnerability to the situation, and potential embarrassment… a TRUE friend does not announce it publicly over the loudspeaker while pointing and bringing you to pubic shame!!!

As for Grim’s personal faults and flaws, his use of power dynamics, and his tendencies to sometimes be condescending… while it may seem in his LJ, that I am one of his “fawning adorers”… I am quite capable and quite open with him personally in discussing my own observations of his character and mannerisms… but I do so PRIVATELY.

I have, since this began, gone back and read his LJ’s and the myriad replies… and since recently made examples of his so-called condescension actually INCLUDED instances of interactions with me… I think I can speak with some authority about those examples used, since I personally am aware of the context in which it was spoken… and I did NOT take it as condescending at all that he was “unsure that I was aware of what I had gifted him”… for that is exactly what he was… unsure that I understood what it meant to him… because we had not had an opportunity to communicate more fully or develop that understanding. Sorry guys, nothing condescending about it…

And frankly, having re-read his journal, and the comments, particularly those made by the same friends on the side of judgment now… and the times when I noticed the MOST condescension and arrogance and judgment were in YOUR comments to him. Not in his entries. I am of a spirituality and life-path that is possibly as far from Christianity as it is humanly possible to go… but yet am an avid student of Christian history and philosophy, and can easily out-quote probably most of Grim’s Christian friends on their own Book… and when I read all of this, and my fury and protective shielding nature was awakened one thought came to my mind, and I hope all of you who call yourselves Grim's friends and then attack your friend so publicly when he has made himself vulnerable will think on it carefully!

And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother's eye, but
considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye? Or how wilt thou say to thy brother, Let me pull out the mote out of thine eye; and, behold, a beam is in thine own eye? Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother's eye.

For it is not in “seeing” the broccoli in someone’s teeth that makes you a friend… and it is NOT in the “telling” them of the broccoli… the mark of TRUE friendship is in HOW you tell them of the broccoli… and HOW you allow them to deal with that broccoli with compassion and in a spirit of true love and protection…

And considering that Grim is not only allowing all of you to attack him in public forum, without retribution, but in a spirit of openness, vulnerability, and wishing to better himself… he is proving himself to be a much TRUER friend to all of you, then frankly you are being to him.

And not that it matters to any of you… but those of you who have behaved in this manner… have lost my respect, whether you remain his friends or not.

~Aurora WindDancer

Aurora -

Perhaps prior to writing such a rant, you should have read Samuel's Original Post? The one that states:

Right now, I'm about learning, especially about the not-so-pleasant aspects of me. I need to learn about how to interact with others better and deal with how people really think and feel about me. Honesty, not fawning. Community forum. No filters.

Since Grim specifically asked for publicly posted criticism, on what grounds are you climbing on your high horse to castigate people who are doing exactly what Grim asked them to do in exactly the way and forum he asked them to respond in?

I suggest you owe both Grim and all who posted that you so roundly criticized for doing as he asked an apology, and I also suggest you try reading (with comprehension) the Original Post before you go off into left field with more inappropriate rants.

*laughs*... again a prime example of how those so willing to criticize Grim for condescension or arrogance or a myriad of other triats and fallacies... are so guilty of all of those things themselves...

I DID read WITH comprehension the entire original post from Grim, with admiration and respect for him... and a deep understanding of the personal strength and willingness to tackle his own "stuff" and allow his "friends" and opportunity to be open with him and publically criticize him. Of Grim I am immensely proud!

Of you, and I have no idea who you are, or what your relationship is to him... and of others who have so quickly risen to the occasion to take his offer and give him a swift and public floggin... I remain disgusted. And I am certainly NOT alone in my disgust.

If Grim needs, desires, or in anyway lets me know I owe him an apology and have crossed a line with him by letting all of you know how despicable I think you and what you are doing are (whether he asked you to or not...)... then he shall have my apology with all heart-felt sincerity, for I am incapable of intentionally causing him harm, and will be abjectly sorrowful if I have done so in my protective wrath at you.

And if he asks me to apologize to you... then I will, in honor and respect to him... whether I think you deserve it or not.

And I may be on a "high horse"... but I would rather be harshly criticized and mocked for being true to my heart and treating my beloved friend with true compassion, and insisting and demanding that others do the same... then for being an insensitive prick, which is exactly what some of you are being.

If Grim is unhappy with me, then Grim may scold me. My Dominant is in full agreement with me, so I have no concerns there.

Oh yeah, and to point out that you missed a small but significant part of Grim's original post...

"Apparently there are those who do not feel comfortable in other forums, so...here it is."

None of this would have been necessary... had those of you with these observations and issues, and lack of sensitivity or compassion, had the personal strength of character and integrity to speak to Grim privately, personally, as real friends would. And just because he is giving you the opportunity... acknowledging your inability to discuss these issue with him in more appropriate manners, and allowing you your inappropriate behavior... does not make your taking him up on it right or appropriate.

A true friend would have said "Wow... he's going through something... I wonder if he is ok? I wonder if he needs someone to talk to? I wonder what has brought this about? I should check on him... give him a call, send him an e-mail... let him know I care... and then maybe talk to him personally, in the spirit of friendship, about my own concerns or observations of things he may wish to work on improving."...

Did you do that? I doubt it... you don't seem the kind to think that way. And as of last night, I was the only one who had, who saw my friend struggling, and thought maybe he might need some support to go along with all this "honesty"! So kiss off.

Obviously you completely missed the entire point of my rant, but rather became defensive, unwilling to even acknowledge the "beam in your own eye"

"None of this would have been necessary... had those of you with these observations and issues, and lack of sensitivity or compassion, had the personal strength of character and integrity to speak to Grim privately, personally, as real friends would."

Aurora, you made an excellent about discretion on the part of "brocolli friends" - how in reality we ought to lean over quietly and whisper rather than voice it over the microphone. And when Grim pointed this out to me, I immediately sent him a private email asking on which topic would he like to further the discussion. That email has not been answered.

Which begs the question: Grim? Why not?

For having attached my rant to your post, rather than the anonymous one as I had intended. While my protective nature took issue with your comments and their delivery, my true fury was raised by a person of cowardice that would attack anonymously, that is without honor.

I do not expect everyone to agree with me, but thank you for acknowledging me, and the issues with maturity. To you, I give respect, and my apology

*bows*
~Aurora

Aurora -

Your other problem is Grim asked for comments. You have decreed that any comments that are not fawning must, ipso facto, be personal attacks.

Please note I made no personal attacks against Grim. I merely provided, in language carefully both polite and neutral, as requested, constructive criticisms based on what I have observed of his behaviours.

Nor do you know me well enough to comment on my honour. I can only assume from your rants and your inability to accept constructive criticism (not attacks) of a friend (even when requested by that friend) that you are not necessarily a person I'd like to meet, nor one with whom I'd share a dojo.

My respect for Grim does not extend to you.

I also note we have not heard from Grim himself. Samuel, about time for you to chime in with comments, please.

*breathes deeply*

My apologies for not waiting 24 hours...

Anonymous - since you give not your name nor identify yourself

Grim asked for criticism, Yes he did, and he needs that feedback. Grim opened himself up to vulnerability and left himself open for attack, not an easy thing to do. One would hope that those closest to him would realize that.

You may not feel you made personal attacks on Grim, others may read it/feel it differently. Once calmed I read your comments again, and in some ways they were quite eloquent and even somewhat lovely. Your comments, in combination with a somewhat steady rain of these types of personal "critiques" given in a public forum rather than privately and personally as it should be between friends (In my not-so-humble opinion), certainly have value in teaching and lessons for Grim...

It was not my intention to stop his learning, or the critiquing, but rather to protect and defend a loved one from those who seem oblivious to his vulnerability at the moment, and were seemingly very willing to take his personal flaws, faults, weaknesses, and warts... and lay them out there for all the world to see... without considering the harm they may be doing first.

FYI, I have already spoken with him, and made my apologies.

I do not care if you respect me or not... being one who would kill or die to protect a loved one... my only concern is for him, and that you respect him. If you do, and he is fine with you, then I apologize. Standing up for what one believes is right does not often win a popularity contest, and I don't really care what you think of me, I know my worth.

As for your honour, and my questioning of it... you are right, I don't know you... and you still hide behind no name... but I do not question your honour as a person... I questioned the honor of the action. Again, perhaps not my place to do so.

I also question the wisdom and sensitivity of one who would use Grim's first name in such an open public unfiltered, uncensored format, not once but twice. I've never seen any of his friends do that before. Perhaps he does not mind that... not my place to say if he would or would not... but I do question it.

Perhaps it is best we do not meet... for I am one who will fly in the face of anyone I perceive may bring harm or attack one I care for, especially when they have allowed themselves to be vulnerable to it. It may not be wise, but it is loyal.

The use of his name was the other reason that I surmised that Anon does not have an LJ account, and thus is unfamiliar with online communities. My SIL is a bellydancer and has a dance name. One night at a dance show I mentioned to an employee at the restaurant that I was with "***" mt SIL's actual name. They just stared at me: "who?" Later, my SIL pulled me aside and tutored me that the people who know her as Leylah, do not know her real name and it is that way on purpose. I had NO idea. I felt silly. I wonder if Anon is unaware of our no-name custom? I think even I used his actual name in my early days of LJ, unaware. I'm not trying to defend anyone, just trying to offer up possible misunderstandings that could be mistrued as deliberate actions.

Aurora, that was very big of you to offer up apologies, particularly to an anonymous party. Not that you need my approval, but you certainly have earned my respect. *Bows* My I "friend" you on my LJ?

but... since I'm not sure how else to answer you Nericksx. Thank you for accepting my apology, and for the honor of "friend" *smiles*... I'm pretty sure I've made an enemy or two in this, but such is life. Glad to know you aren't one of them.

I'm not sure if the Anon I went off on and Aria are the same or if that is the other Anon, I can't unravel it anymore... but whoever that was... they were the lucky "last straw" so to speak... and probably unaware of the history leading up to this...

I may have overreacted, but in my heart, nothing about how I feel about all this has changed, just that my temper has cooled after talking to Grim and seeing another perspective, and understanding his "why" of this request.

What I was seeing, was someone I love, being brow-beaten by his "friends" unknown to me, for reasons I could not fathom, and not in manners I personally could respect by being public about it... so I... (yes that's right I, me, over here, loudmouthed one) Judged the "broccoli" crowd and anyone who seemed to be jumping on that bandwagon...

and I got righteously furious and protective, of seeing my loved one standing there in front of us all, naked, unshielded, no armour, hurting, trying to work through his "stuff", vulnerable... and willing to take the beating... feeling proud of him, but angry at those who in my eyes were "kicking him while he was down, and pour salt and lemon on his wounds"...

So.. I ranted. Not an excuse, I make no excuses... but I felt you all deserved an explanation of my behavior.

Grim pointed out to me that anger and rage are all about fear... so what are you afraid of Aurora?

I was afraid of seeing him hurt... and seeing his newfound willingness to be vulnerable squashed forever, cut short before it even bloomed...

I am sorry for ranting... and I do apologize to Anon (whichever one it was)... I saw you as an unknown attacker, and just started swinging... when clearly, you love Grim just as much as me... probably more, and longer.

And now, I'm done...

*bows to all*
~Aurora

It's good that Grim has such a loyal friend in close proximity. Grim and Aurora are lucky to have each other. *nods, smiles*

Anon ~ in honesty I ask. Please answer to my wondering, only why so many would feel need to fawn, somehow means not constructive though still allowing own critique of my friend? Its clear you seem not to hold this a valid form of progression to ones own truths.
Thanks,
Respectfully pinkk

as honest curious of pinkk.

Perhaps I needed to hear you as well.

Respect honors both the giver and the recipient. Thank you for yours, and you have with this grace earned mine.

Spasibo.

Just amazed by your behavior since meeting your mind! Pride in all feelings, yep trust I come always with stroking, *butt* as to such a Lady as you are Aurora, may I lick your hand instead?
My truths of flesh are most vividly seen by those lost to own self the desire to touch themselves. Grim when I said you had alot of guts to gather such strong women around you ~ this may have been why I quit doing the learn from the ladies around us both. Sometimes there are just to many emotions and reactions Not the quick glance that may bring forth such silly a discussion, may find deeper a feeling was that when so long felt themselves desire to push an issue they may have finally quit being afraid and taken this to be a place atleast feel heard.

Some only find you this way or that when in teacher or friend you arent both always? That seems rather shallow the glimpse allowed. Never have I felt disconnection to all you are ~ that is comparing your spirit to topdressing on the farm. just slather you up with BS of what feels like layer of friend isn't as nice as your teacher! All that really says to me is that some of your friends aren't able to accept you without being shitty because they just feel "I hurt, its your fault"
deep heart with my grumpy bratt at the moment ~ sick pup a true (pardon me, sweet Lady)BITCH ~ is heated so I face this within my own home and from yours! Mother (again pardon) Freaking oh FUCK YOU all with no lube! deeper than you imagine I am, I'll bore you while he's waiting for the ratings ~ Good Luck I saw a 9 butt I am inverted alot so 6 could mean still ranked if is your need. I hate being rude butt not when feel my friends are being attacked in a backhanded slap from souls just needing attention ~ oh Goody my reason has arrived!

Today as watched sun rise, laughing he snored, warm from your admittance, felt spine tingles & beat began I was not familiar with, now I recognize it ~ passionate is a primal reaction & I'm proud all your friends so primed have been so polite, yet good to see how eyes wide to you look also around you. My Lumpy was told by ex drums of no more learning that I was whore gift to HIM,(well we both know I am its ok) but it was then thrown as nails in flesh to bring forth only blood ~ he claimed the gift me was done even with knowing he was letting sacrifice of the music & band they were So Lumpy got pussy like Yoko ~ Oh No the pussy was surely all HIS from then owned never tarnished the truth of what we are for each other ~ butt pussy shit like this crippled self growths. Dumb Ass just wiggling my *butt* never am I seen, carry in or out, gear, liquid, Hell hon every time I drive I pay for a ride with a blowjob because its my righteous choice & sweetest the eyes burn brite and my body reacts to all growing in guitar sounds as I choose to slip back & allow hips to grind nips to harden & smile fill my heart! There was another thought I used to let run me cold at that point ~ Yoko Ono was not my worth or my own self the reason for their lack of his band keeping it together. It was the fear of his drummers view that haunted my heart, for 6 of the past 7 years I've spent time only believing I had been the part of the cause! i am modest mostly, mostly ~ know I hadn't been whoring around LRC long enough to be reason they split. Silly lil' girls don't forget & he meant no harm teasing just Yoko ~ flood of bratt came out & no stopping self made face ~ thanks Daddy HIM he sees it now ~ Royal Rage growled , proud you already know his monster WOW force with power to see spirit so ~ opened the can found worms 6 yrs patience & true love held together by lots of fucks ~ 1 fool crapped on view of self & it mattered, not enough ~ held my being as yoko ono in some twist, also spewed forth to his that he HATES (my)Brian & only wants (my)Lumpy, feels Brian can die! 6 years before we spoke angry of such BS ~ felt from such BULLSHIT thickly spread atop skin for in truth we hope our freinds would only try helping! ok more nyquil and leave your journal!

HOWEVER… a TRUE friend will do so by gently leaning over, whispering in your ear in a very discreet manner, shielding you physically from the sight of others, giving you an opportunity to remove the offending green vegetable in privacy, with discretion, compassion and consideration for your feelings, your vulnerability to the situation, and potential embarrassment… a TRUE friend does not announce it publicly over the loudspeaker while pointing and bringing you to pubic shame!!!

I have privately attempted to discuss with Grim the issues I have with his behavior more times than I can count in the years I've known him. None of my concerns were ever addressed in any way, shape, or form. Nothing was ever his fault -- is was the fault of the chaos which he conveniently allows to run his life so that he does not have to take responsibility for himself, his choices, his actions or inactions. It is for this reason that he no longer plays an active role in my life although there will always be a place for him in my heart.

From my perspective, until he is confronted en masse by all those who care about him but dislike aspects of his behavior, Grim will not make any changes.

Just for the record... this anonymous poster is a different anonymous poster than my anonymous posts..

Didn't want anyone to get confused :-)

AnonyMoose the First

Just so I can keep everyone rants straight, would AnonyMoose be willing to own up to his/her posts? I like to keep my mooses straight :-)

Just so I can keep everyone rants straight, would AnonyMoose be willing to own up to his/her posts? I like to keep my mooses straight :-)

I do not have an LJ account and I am relatively certain that I do not know any of the other posters, save one. I am also fairly certain that Grim knows who I am based on the comments I made and the way I phrased them. He's heard them before... I see no reason for the rest of you to know my name since none of you know me and after all, these comments are for Grim and his personal growth, yes?

But...if you need a name, call me Aria.

Thanks Aria, but I just wanted to sort out which Anon you are. It is perfectly fine by me that we don't know your name (as I believe I pointed out in ne of my own posts). Am I correct in deducting that all the Anon posts belong to you excpet for the one directly above, timestamped:17:51?

Am I correct in deducting that all the Anon posts belong to you excpet for the one directly above, timestamped:17:51?

No. I have made three previous posts (now four including this one): the three signed Aria and the one timestamped 17:51.

The ones made earlier belong to AnonyMoose the First.

Aria

Ah. Thank you so much. Of course, as I was trying to figure this all out, I realized that I do not *need* to know who's moose is who, as long as Grim knows. I guess I just like a good puzzle ;-)

Grim's friends need to bare in mind that we all have very very different relationships with him, so we interact differently. The ONLY person who has ground to judge if the interaction is acceptable or not is GRIM.

In response to your invitation for feedback:
Ok, that was maybe a bit the other direction. By my suggestion that you be open to honest feedback to your normal journal entries, I did not intend to imply that you should take off your armour and hand out rocks. I'm not sure that that is super-healthy either. And truly, (although you could not have see this coming) all it did was start a flame-throwing session by your other "non-broccoli" friends. However, I do have the utmost respect for you in using this to become a better person, despite the imperfectness of the tool. On this point, the RWB and I collaborated and this is what we came up with: we actually agree with Aurora (on this point, only) that your faults should not be called attention to publicly. However, until the anon post and the post by

jic where you actually solicited it, this has not happened. We feel that pointing out where a lesson could be learned to help you professionally or academically is our duty as friends. We also feel that it is not calling attention to all your horrid underpinnings, but having a little constructive feedback in a forum where everyone is your friend and wants to see you succeed, so it is hardly "public." And it isn't like

jic had a personal beef with you ("you scumbag, when you were here you drank all the milk left your dirty grundies on the living room couch!") and used LJ to have it out with you, but merley cited personal examples to back up a lesson she was trying to convey in response to a post.

On offering constructive criticism:
We again collaborated and decided that we agree on one area of improvement to share. The RWB pointed out that friendships rarely disintegrate because of some type of action, but more often from inaction. I'm going to have to chime in with Anon and

jic when I say that occasionally your stated esteem for someone is not borne out by actions. We have sometimes felt that you visit only when you need something, a nap, a cup of coffee, etc. and not just for the sake of visiting. I believe we addressed this however, and had a lovely visit with you not that long ago. I also have some lovely pictures from 12/26/04 that prove that you've been here for reasons other than a cup of joe and a pillow. So, I think we need not belabor the point further.

Hmmmm... I guess your biggest fault is - we like you so much we'd like to see you more often? I am guessing that you can handle that ;-) I think next time you visit, I'll have to invite

jic too and we'll all have cheddar broccoli soup!

P.S. I do have thoughts on the power-dynamic/condescension thing, but if you are at all interested in exploring my experience, I'm happy to do it in my kitchen over said soup.

Beautifully handled... and much more graceful than my rant...

*bows*
~Aurora

Gee... *blushes* thanks :-)

With your permission, I would extend your complement to my husband - the RWB - as well, for he is the cool lime jello which neutralizes my Atomic Fireball Jawbreaker nature. I would not be so eloquent without his input.

*bows to you*
*bows to the RWB*

As to the Anon poster: if one doesn't have an LJ account, you can still post to one's LJ but the user is labeled "anon." You could of course sign your name, but I can almost guarantee that Grim will know who that person is. So they are only anon from us, but surely not from Grim. As much as I'm dyin' to know who that is, I do not need to know. That is between Anon and Grim. I have a feeling that Anon and Grim have such a relationship that that is how they are with each other, and Anon did not make comments out of malice. That is evidenced by how they took care to use a Grim-friendly metaphor as a vehicle for their thoughts.

As to the quagmire that poor Grim's LJ has become: strangely, this forum has become about the the posters (for some) and not the postee. In everyone's defense, Grim asked for it. Whether you feel it is right or wrong to take him up on it is another matter. I doubt anyone here (most CERTAINLY not me) would have the courage to take off one's armor and hand out rocks. If Grim wants his LJ community to oblige him in creating a digital gauntlet, who are we to deny him that? I think that as long the insight is kept reasonably general (no, "remember that time back in '97 when you said....") and done in a true spirit of helpfulness and caring, then it can be nothing but positive, if hard to take.

Actually in reading people's comments that they (for the most part) have taken great care to craft, I'm kinda dying' to meet everyone now. (Particularly [info]ms_pinkk who's K-9 nature has me utterly scratching my head. Perhaps I would do better to offer to scratch pinkk's head? :-)) Everyone has such a unique method of presenting themselves online, Grim surely does have a diverse group of... groupies?

Grim: I know you said you wouldn't reply, but you gotta gotta GOTTA! I am so curious to have your thoughts about what you have started ;-)

*laughing merrily*... I don't know you, but I can tell I would like you

My respect to you Friend of Grim!
~Aurora

*grin*

nericksx and RWB are indeed wonderful people. In fact, it was they who first introduced me to Grim. If you ever do get the chance, she's even more delightful company in person than here. (And RWB is definitely as she describes him.)

ok, ok, that's enough, I'm getting all veklempt!

*waves hand dismissivley while turning and blushing*

*Genuflects with deep respect to Aurora & Jic, Fellow Friends of Grim*

Yes, someday we'll have to have a F.O.G. reunion (Friends of Grim). Yes Grim, we are your FOG!

*laughs self right off chair*

Btw all F.O.G. it's the fact any tone shows only the true feelings all only have him in their heart. As for meeting each weird dog he may keep close know only my own growth is tone I speak from, & wouldn't expect others to pet me if not their need. Mine madness is always to pass as gift, for whatever may be received. Please don't feel the groupie need to flesh, if not yours ~ in skin we would all become most likely close friends as F.O.G. cleared seen from only within his heart for reasons we all should be so honored. Thanks for caring in anyway you allow the self towards him. From heart of dog is loyalty that can admit it sometimes gets caught licking her own bitch ass. *pinkk ~ blush*

Anon did not make comments out of malice. That is evidenced by how they took care to use a Grim-friendly metaphor as a vehicle for their thoughts.

Since AnonyMoose the First is the one person I know who has posted and is someone I know very, very well, I can affirm this comment. Had AnonyMoose intended the comments to anything other than a thoughtful and useful (to Grim) response, they would have been vastly different in tone and content.

And lest anyone misunderstand me, let me be plain. I love Grim. But his behaviors make a continuing relationship impossible at this time. Should things change, he knows where I live and how to reach me.

By these comments I see that I have probably given Grim clues to incorrectly deduce the identity of AnonyMoose and I will say only this -- it's likely not the person you think it is. I do not mean to mislead, but cannot say more.

Aria

And I'll respond.

I scanned through most of this thread and your horoscope and personality test.

This is a pretty weighty request you’ve made and frankly I’m more than a little surprised that you would make it.

Honestly, I don’t have a lot of personal experience with you to make huge conclusions about how you can improve as an individual relating to others. But I think the statement in and of it’s self says a lot, that I don’t have many personal experiences with you. I can relate to many of the statements that the anonymous poster made regarding to how you handle relationships and how you wield chaos as a buffer or rationale to protect yourself or pull away from any who would desire to get close to you but for some reason you choose not to reciprocate. Reading your journal and having the little contact I do have with you I feel like you like the chaos and revel in it when your words might be saying otherwise.

I am a numbers person and not a verbal person so I will keep my response short and if you desire further clarification I’ll be more than happen to expand if you reach out to me. But, again, that is the rub isn’t it? Having the desire or energy to reach out for that personal contact, I have to say I’m a little surprised you scored as high as you did on the extroverted end. The picture of you in my mind tended to reflect someone more like myself, in large familiar gatherings being extroverted and social but largely, for whatever purposes one wishes to attach, but in more personal one and one relations being more reserved and introverted. It’s easy to dawn the image of what people want to see in a large gathering but that’s vastly different than pushing yourself out there for people to see. But then again, this could just be me reflecting myself into my image of you as an explanation for the “lack of personal experiences”.

Hmmm... I never got a chance to actually read and follow this until now. I have been told about it by a few different people. One who said, "You should read it", one who said, "Don't even mention Grim's blog to me!" and another one who just started laughing. So...
I've read through most of it, skipping over parts but getting the general gist.
All I have to say is "How very interesting... and how very Grim".

Kittin

Based upon what I've read in your journal so far, I wanted to mention something to you Grim, if I may. I'm not going to comment on whether you are using this journal to allow others to fawn all over you, or any of that other stuff. I haven't read enough to make that distinction.

However, coming from a newcomers standpoint, I do believe you also use this journal to lead others. By sharing your innermost thoughts, we are able to watch you as you make your way through the forest, blazing a path for others to follow. This doesn't mean you don't sometimes go through a briar patch, this doesn't mean that every step you take is the right step. But when you do misstep, you seem to have no problems recognizing it (although it may sometimes take a while) and you don't hesitate to turn and find the right step.

No, you are not perfect. But you are a warrior, you are strong, and you have my utmost respect.

Here's a gift for you, a quote to carry with you...

"The moment we learn from it, a mistake becomes a lesson."

Yes. *bow*

Community Forum

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Maybe it's just me...

Re: Maybe it's just me...

Re: Maybe it's just me...

Incredibly Impressed with you Temple of God

Re: Incredibly Impressed with you Temple of God

Woof Woof ~ it's not just her... or me... fawn pup licking your hand as friend

hope you knew that wasn't all pinkk needed to say, to you

Re: hope you knew that wasn't all pinkk needed to say, to you

Re: hope you knew that wasn't all pinkk needed to say, to you

*blushes, truly honored*

Amazed... and not ashamed to say it

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I'll try to avoid casual use of hyperbole this time

Furious… Fuming… and Disgusted…

Silly Rant (was: Re: Furious… Fuming… and Disgusted…)

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Re: Silly Rant (was: Re: Furious… Fuming… and Disgusted…)

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An apology to you JIC...

An aside to Aurora

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Two more tiny cents about Anon

Wow... I hate to be the person who adds one more thing to this! (Re: Two more tiny cents about Anon

Re: Wow... I hate to be the person who adds one more thing to this! (Re: Two more tiny cents about A

Re: ipso facto

Re: ipso facto oops wrong place please still receive this

Accepted

Re: bratt pup PROUD & Stroking you sweet Lady

Re: Furious… Fuming… and Disgusted…

Re: Just to Keep Things Straight...

Head is swimming

Re: Head is swimming

Re: Head is swimming

Re: Head is swimming

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Insight

Re: Insight

Re: Insight

Re: Insight

She's awesome that way.

Re: She's awesome that way.

Re: F.O.G. awesome that way, as friendship shown in any tone warm & loving

Re: Insight

You Asked

Interesting...

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blushes, truly honored